Hotkey for toggling VOCALS on/off

[marcosilva85]

I was patiently waiting for a true karaoke experience with Ultrastar. Now that usdb_syncer also has Stem separation, it is now much easier for anyone to create song versions with separate #AUDIO (instrumental) and #VOCALS track.

It seems that for Ultrastar the #VOCALS support was merged #1083

I've tested v2026.6.0 with such song format, and while it works (with TAB menu), I cannot find a hotkey to toggle #VOCALS on and off.
Is there a key equivalent of K (this one quickly toggles between #INSTRUMENTAL / #AUDIO)., but for #VOCALS ?

Would also be interesting if we could set that hotkey to toggle between two user-defined #VOCALS volumes, like 100%/20%. Does it sound like an interesting feature to have?

[bohning]

K should toggle between regular and instrumental track.

[marcosilva85]

I know that. but I wasn't asking about the #Instrunental.toggle
I am asking about a toggling hotkey for the new #Vocals track ( and if it would also be possible to configure the toggle so it goes between two user defined volumes, like 100% / 20% for example).

[dgruss]

The vocals track is parsed but not supported in any user-reaching part of the game.

The current shape of this is that K turns instrumentals volume up while turning the audio volume down. You can also use the sliders to find a sweet spot that works well for you.

What you want is to turn the instruments lower than the vocals (or even off)? Or, expressed differently, in the current volume sliders (when you press Tab) you want the Vocals Volume to be possibly higher than the regular song audio/instrumentals?

[marcosilva85]

As a user I can actually get the true Karaoke mode with this #VOCALS feature in the TAB menu, let me give an example with Daughtry - Home.txt

With usdb_syncer latest version, I use the stem separation when retrieving the song, so, besides #AUDIO:Daughtry - Home.mp3 , I see that the song ultrastar txt file is already supporting:

• #INSTRUMENTAL:Daughtry - Home [INSTR].mp3
• #VOCALS:Daughtry - Home [VOC].mp3

1. I play this music in Ultrastar, then in the TAB menu, I can see AUDIO and VOCALS sliders. Both start with volume ON at 100%, at this point everything is sounding like the original song.
2. I lower the VOCALS volume down to 10% or 0% via the TAB menu, and go back.
3. I now hear as "karaoke" , since I hear only the instrumental part playing.

To be simple, I am merely requesting a hotkey that does the same, so we do not need to manually perform these multiple steps.

[dgruss]

The key K does that. But it does require the regular and the instrumental version, the vocals tag is parsed but not used, none of the volume sliders has an effect on whatever is provided for the vocals tag.

[marcosilva85]

The key K does that. But it does require the regular and the instrumental version, the vocals tag is parsed but not used, none of the volume sliders has an effect on whatever is provided for the vocals tag.

I understand, but that does not give the flexibility of the Vocals track: I usually mix a bit of vocals (let's say 20%) as guests prefer to sing over that, instead of pure instrumental K toggle, which is harder to follow by amateur singers.
(I used to do that mixing and processing of tracks manually in my spare time).

Melody Mania (Ultrastar Play) already allows VOCALS track mixing , user can choose how much Volume to mix in. I'm merely asking for that in USDX via hotkey, since I find USDX to be almost perfect. And now with usdb_syncer feature, it's possible to streamline and have it soo simple on Ultrastar DX, just need a hotkey to toggle over two preset VOCALS volumes.

Hope the use case is more clear.

[dgruss]

I'm still not sure i understand.
Currently K toggles between vocals 0% and 100%, you want the lower level to be configurable so that K toggles between 20% and 100%?
Did I get that right now?
That level should be configurable in the game's options?

(also, this has nothing to do with the vocals tag technically)

[bohning]

I think the confusion stems from the fact that K toggles between "use audio from #MP3 (vocals + instrumental in a single track)" and "use audio from #INSTRUMENTAL (instrumental only track)". Ergo, #VOCALS is currently not used anywhere. When you adjust the volumes in the help screen, you're not adjusting how much #VOCALS are mixed in, but how much #MP3 is mixed in (at least I think that's how it currently works).

[dgruss]

UI wise it might not be ideal to add more options and instead just let the game remember the last state. K could just toggle between 2 volume settings without caring what they are?
By default: regular mode is vocals 100% and the toggled mode (karaoke) is vocals 0%.
if you are in regular mode and turn down vocals, it could save this. Same for the toggled mode.
The risk is that someone changes the setting then and has no idea why K doesn't do what they expected anymore

[marcosilva85]

Thanks for the input. I'm also a fan of keeping things intuitive, @dgruss, so I'd definitely keep K as the Instrumental on/off shortcut.
I think the biggest source of confusion is that the labels in the TAB menu don't actually represent the available tracks.

To better align with the format specification, perhaps the TAB menu labels should be renamed to something like:

• Instrumental (when available)
• Vocals (when available)
• Complete Audio (when available)

Since any of these tracks may be absent, their corresponding volume sliders could simply be disabled in that scenario.

Also, I was discussing supporting the exclusive-vocals track: #VOCALS . I assumed that support was built in USDX with #1083 but seems is not the case.
But if is possible to actually bring support of #VOCALS in USDX , they would play on top of the #Instrumental track.
Then, to have a simple and consistent behavior, toggling #VOCALS could be a 3-state, with a separate toggle key, let's say V:

Off → Preferred Vocals Volume → Full Vocals Volume

That way, the behavior remains predictable and accommodates both use cases.

[dgruss]

i would not use vocals to mix instrumentals and vocals in game - if vocals and instrumentals shall be mixed it would always be a mix between instrumentals and complete audio. the synchronization between different audio tracks is not absolutely perfect, so mixing it this way is a source of potential issues that one can avoid especially when there is no necessity for it.
i don't make the calls, but whatever vocals will be used for, if anything, i would say, not that.

V is already occupied for video related behavior.

K already does what you want, except that it toggles just between 0% and 100% vocals effectively. From the user perspective (not someone who edits the txt files) this is also correctly labeled: it describes the behavior of the game correctly. The technical aspects how it is implemented is a separate question.

You want additionally a preferred volume step / this being configurable - that can be done. The vocals tag has nothing to do with that and I would leave it if possible to avoid introducing additional surface for potential buggy behavior.

Many users also run the game without a vocals audio file for each song but with an instrumentals file for each song. Now requiring a vocals file for the vocals slider to work (which is already working) would be a regression for all of these users.

[dgruss]

i thought about this a bit more.

option 1 one somewhat stateless but intuitive way would be to enable numbers after pressing K to set the lower level:

K 0 -> vocals at 0%
K 4 -> vocals at 40%
K 2 -> vocals at 20%

the lower threshold is kept while the game is running so pressing K then toggles between the chosen level and full vocals, so continuing the above would continue as

K --> vocals at 100%
K --> vocals at 20% again
K --> vocals at 100%
K --> vocals at 20% again

and so on.

this is not kept across restarts and has less potential to accidentally confuse users, in the worst case a restart restores the state

a stateful alternative (option 2) would be:

K -> toggle between "low" and "high" vocals level

by default they are at 0% and 100%

adjusting vocals in the help screen acts as follows:
moving the vocals slider to 100% --> reset everything so that low is 0% and high is 100% and K is in the full vocals mode

moving the vocals slider to any other value than 100% --> move into the low vocals level if we have not already been there and adjust the low vocals level to whatever the user selected.

this would then be stateful across game restarts but also would allow users to intuitively get back to the level they wanted. the game restarts in the last mode it was running in --> at the lower vocals level if it was a lower vocals level

i think the second option is better, more intuitive and easier to implement

[dgruss]

@marcosilva85 would the behavior shown in #1361 match what you were expecting?